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  #361  
Old 03-08-2015, 10:35 PM
allitersonance allitersonance is offline
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Default Re: Question Box

Do nothing shouldn't take up a conditional; it's pretty easy to just reword it so it's "unless x, y, x" and if you don't specify anything else you'd do nothing anyway. Struggle would, though, since it's something happening.
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  #362  
Old 03-08-2015, 10:57 PM
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Music Dragon Music Dragon is offline
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Default Re: Question Box

To what extent are Pokémon capable of choosing actions independently? For example, can you give commands such as "Use any of your Fire-type moves, I don't care which one" or "Pick one of these two moves at random"?

I feel like there might be certain balance issues with allowing randomized commands, but it also doesn't really make sense that a Pokémon would be unable to understand such commands. (Though I suppose the usual justification for why Pokémon need trainers in the first place is that Pokémon are hideously bad at battling on their own.)
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  #363  
Old 03-08-2015, 11:23 PM
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Default Re: Question Box

I feel like Do Nothing is the default action when a pokémon's conditionals overlap in such a way that it isn't commanded to do anything in particular. Struggle is more of a thing when a pokémon can't use a move it was otherwise supposed to.
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...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pokémon Showdown VGC
[00:31:16] @dingram: makiri an you make someone a driver real quick
[00:31:19] #makiri: why
[00:31:19] @dingram: just so they can say something
[00:31:21] @dingram: and demote them
[00:31:26] +Superbird: inb4 demotes dingram to driver
[00:31:26] @dingram: i want to see if my bot logs the message
[00:31:32] @dingram: no it cant be me
[00:31:45] #makiri: who am i drivering
[00:31:47] +AnotherDimension$$: Me
[00:31:49] @dingram: uh Superbird
[00:31:51] +Kirito11: me lol
[00:32:12] +Superbird: wait rly
[00:32:18] @dingram: i just chose a random active user
[00:32:23] @dingram: just say something
Superbird was promoted to Room Driver by makiri.
[00:32:24] @dingram: anything
[00:32:32] %Superbird: cool
[00:32:34] %Superbird: yay
[00:32:34] @dingram: ok done
[00:32:36] %Superbird: this feels awesome
[00:32:37] @dingram: ty makiri
[00:32:38] %Superbird: while it lasts
[00:32:41] +z2porygon: lol screen shot
[00:32:54] @dingram: you can demote now :3
[00:32:57] +AnotherDimension$$: Superbird
[00:32:59] +AnotherDimension$$: Warn me
Superbird was promoted to Room Voice by makiri.
[00:33:02] @dingram: just doing testing with bot
[00:33:05] +Superbird: well that was fun while it lasted
[00:33:12] @dingram: im glad you didnt like mute anyone
[00:33:13] @dingram: or anything
[00:33:16] +z2porygon: lol
[00:33:21] +Superbird: i shouldve though
[00:33:24] @dingram: no
[00:33:24] +Superbird: ill make a note for next time
[00:33:25] @dingram: ;-;
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  #364  
Old 03-08-2015, 11:39 PM
allitersonance allitersonance is offline
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Default Re: Question Box

I'd say randomised commands are fine. The result isn't expected to be optimal so the pokemon would still be subpar at battling on its own. There probably should be limits, like the more moves it has to choose from, the longer the pokemon hesitates (effectively dropping speed that action) or has a chance of failing to do anything; that's just to discourage making things annoying for the ref, who'd have to do the legwork of finding all the fire moves and randomising from that, or whatever.

I like to have something that's effectively "do nothing" if the pokemon is prevented from using its move because it still makes the attempt but fails, and it's not hurting itself just because it can't do a thing, but I guess struggle is an okay alternative there. But it only shouldn't take up a command slot if it's doing struggle on its own.
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  #365  
Old 03-09-2015, 12:40 AM
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Zhorken Zhorken is offline
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Default Re: Question Box

I'm about to tackle the backlog of tournament prize Pokémon, but first I want to bring up the 1 exp again.

Several people said they want to treat their consolation Pokémon as being the Pokémon they rented, and speaking as a tournament loser, that totally makes sense to me. MF said that wouldn't make sense with Sylveon/Eevee, but Flareth gave her free Eevee the same gender and nickname as her rental Sylveon anyway. Besides, it's not like ASB Pokémon follow causality all that strictly, what with battles taking place at the same time and all.

Even if someone does want to pick a different gender/ability, I don't see the problem with that! Think of it as a retcon. Or if they really do want a separate Pokémon of the same species... they've still more or less earned the right to that 1 exp on that Pokémon, so I still don't see any reason not to.

In conclusion: please please pleeeeease, MF? :D

Last edited by Zhorken; 03-09-2015 at 12:47 AM.
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  #366  
Old 03-09-2015, 12:42 AM
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Default Re: Question Box

I agree with Zhorken on the experience thing!

it would be super cute come on
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  #367  
Old 03-09-2015, 01:10 AM
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Default Re: Question Box

Tempting as it is, EXP is a little valuable to be a first-round consolation prize -- anyone who's eliminated before Rare Candies start being awarded has essentially missed out on a much better reward that they could have gotten by losing faster. That doesn't make a lot of sense. Hell, awarding the rental Pokémon per se has already curtailed a good amount of sense in this regard, particularly in that sometimes this has entailed a free rarity-eight Pokémon (although at least all the folks who were assigned to starters won, heheh).
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  #368  
Old 03-09-2015, 01:14 AM
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Default Re: Question Box

It's not really a consolation prize, though; under normal circumstances (ie. people use their own Pokemon), it's an /expected/ prize. The reason we use rentals in tourneys is to even the playing field in the first round or two, but the battlers are still expending the effort to do battle. (in normal battles with rentals we shouldn't give EXP, though, because people choose to do rentals and probably choose their rental Pokemon. But in this case people were forced to do rentals, so snatching EXP from them because of the tourney's conditions seems rather unfair)
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  #369  
Old 03-09-2015, 01:26 AM
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Default Re: Question Box

Yeah, I agree we should let people get the exp.
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  #370  
Old 03-09-2015, 01:56 AM
Zekrom_B0lt Zekrom_B0lt is offline
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Default Re: Question Box

Why does it seem like most refs want to ref 1 vs 1 battle than a 3 vs 3 battle ?

Example: Grass King's 1 vs 1 compared to the 3 vs 3 metronome battle
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  #371  
Old 03-09-2015, 01:59 AM
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Default Re: Question Box

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zekrom_B0lt View Post
Why does it seem like most refs want to ref 1 vs 1 battle than a 3 vs 3 battle ?
'Cause it's three times harder to ref a 3vs3, at the very least. And, it would be even harder than that because so many pokemon running around at once, so many calculations and things.
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  #372  
Old 03-09-2015, 02:04 AM
allitersonance allitersonance is offline
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Default Re: Question Box

Zekrom probably is referring to 3v3 singles. They're not really harder to ref, they just take longer so they're more of an investment. The thing is that refs are also lazy and want to make a quick buck, and also finishing a battle feels more like an accomplishment than finishing a third of one. So if you want to get a ref quickly, use simpler arenas/rules, bans on healing, higher damage caps, singles rather than doubles or triples, and fewer total pokemon.

Triples are more than three times harder to ref than a 1v1 generally, but the main thing is that it's more daunting to put effort into a single hard thing than it is for lots of easy things, even if they come out to the same at the end.
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  #373  
Old 03-09-2015, 02:04 AM
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Default Re: Question Box

I would imagine that a longer battle would be more of a commitment for a ref, wouldn't it, and we shouldn't impose too much on then, should we?
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  #374  
Old 03-09-2015, 02:10 AM
Zekrom_B0lt Zekrom_B0lt is offline
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Default Re: Question Box

Are 3v3 single [rotatation] Metronome battles easy enough like 1 vs 1 single battles ?

Since only metronome is the only move that is allowed during orders

example:

Trainer 1: metronome
Trainer 2: metronome

Ref

Trainer 2:
Trainer 1:

Ref

Etc
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  #375  
Old 03-09-2015, 02:10 AM
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Default Re: Question Box

Quote:
Originally Posted by allitersonance View Post
Zekrom probably is referring to 3v3 singles. They're not really harder to ref, they just take longer so they're more of an investment. The thing is that refs are also lazy and want to make a quick buck, and also finishing a battle feels more like an accomplishment than finishing a third of one. So if you want to get a ref quickly, use simpler arenas/rules, bans on healing, higher damage caps, singles rather than doubles or triples, and fewer total pokemon.

Triples are more than three times harder to ref than a 1v1 generally, but the main thing is that it's more daunting to put effort into a single hard thing than it is for lots of easy things, even if they come out to the same at the end.
triples are hell to ref, especially when not vanilla

but you make so much money
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If I'm reffing your ASB battle, you can find my reffing scale in this document. Mostly it involves details on stat modifications and status conditions, as well as my interpretation of the damage formula, other clarifications regarding the specifics of certain attacks.
...
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  #376  
Old 03-09-2015, 02:18 AM
allitersonance allitersonance is offline
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Default Re: Question Box

You'd make as much money from three rounds of singles battles though. So if you don't want to put in a lot of effort at once, not worth it. I'd not go above doubles, myself.

Metronome battles are fun to ref because you get to describe destruction and stuff, but they don't "count" as battles, not even for sendout exp, so basically it's just the ref getting money. It's standard to do 1v1 though. Rotation battles are more like 3v3 singles with all pokemon known beforehand though, aren't they? Even triples are okay with metronome because usually someone explodes early or something, but it's more about the entertainment than the ease there.
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  #377  
Old 03-09-2015, 02:18 AM
Zekrom_B0lt Zekrom_B0lt is offline
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Default Re: Question Box

To everyone I'm sorry i asked
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  #378  
Old 03-09-2015, 02:25 AM
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Default Re: Question Box

It's no big deal! Don't be afraid to ask questions.
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  #379  
Old 03-09-2015, 02:02 PM
Ether's Bane Ether's Bane is offline
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Default Re: Question Box

How do I pick up my free Chespin?
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  #380  
Old 03-09-2015, 05:02 PM
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Zhorken Zhorken is offline
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Default Re: Question Box

How much energy should Solar Beam cost in the sun?

Quote:
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How do I pick up my free Chespin?
I'll handle that today; it'll appear at the top of Buy Pokémon, like a promotion.
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