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Question Box

Negrek

busy dizzy lazy
Staff member
Thematically it would make sense for big root to affect leech seed, but since in ASB leech seed already restores as much as it drains. So big root would have to make it restore more than it drained somehow, which strikes me as a bit silly.
 

Eifie

oh man, good times.
Pronoun
she/her
Thematically it would make sense for big root to affect leech seed, but since in ASB leech seed already restores as much as it drains. So big root would have to make it restore more than it drained somehow, which strikes me as a bit silly.
That's how it works in the games, as far as I can tell. Come on, we already break the laws of physics! What's a little conservation of matter on top?
 

Negrek

busy dizzy lazy
Staff member
I guess it can? It's a bit weird, since it's based on the raw HP values, which are most likely unequal between the pokémon, whereas we're working with percentages that are always going to be consistent.

It actually seems like kind of a moot point, because the big root multiplier would have to be huge to actually affect the amount restored by leech seed: like, you're rounding down, so 1.25x 1% is still just 1% recovery. So, that in mind, I guess big root can affect leech seed if you like.

Perhaps we should just put big root up to 1.3x while we're at it, since that's the official multiplier and I don't think there's any particular reason to use a lower one.
 

Eifie

oh man, good times.
Pronoun
she/her
I guess it can? It's a bit weird, since it's based on the raw HP values, which are most likely unequal between the pokémon, whereas we're working with percentages that are always going to be consistent.

It actually seems like kind of a moot point, because the big root multiplier would have to be huge to actually affect the amount restored by leech seed: like, you're rounding down, so 1.25x 1% is still just 1% recovery. So, that in mind, I guess big root can affect leech seed if you like.

Perhaps we should just put big root up to 1.3x while we're at it, since that's the official multiplier and I don't think there's any particular reason to use a lower one.
Aw, I was hoping for 4% per round instead of 3%, but whatev, I guess.

Isn't our multiplier 1.5x? Recovery goes from 50% to 75%.
 

Negrek

busy dizzy lazy
Staff member
Ah, yeah, if you apply the bonus to the amount drained per round rather than per action, you would get an extra point or so of recovery. Seems kind of awkward sticking an extra 1% in for one action and not the others, but that's an aesthetic argument rather than a game design one as such...

Yeah, I guess the multiplier is actually higher than the in-game one. idk, I suppose I don't have any strong feelings on this except that it would be nice to figure out how to get the item to work reasonably for all varieties of drain, but I don't really have a good idea of how to do that. Does anyone else have thoughts?
 

Sandstone-Shadow

A chickadee in love with the sky
Pronoun
she/her
For energy calculation purposes, does "never missing" (Swift, Magical Leaf, etc) count as a secondary effect? I feel like it doesn't count.
 

Sandstone-Shadow

A chickadee in love with the sky
Pronoun
she/her
Also, can something like Encore be affected by accuracy drops? It doesn't seem like it should, but it has 100% accuracy instead of -- accuracy, and if it was an attacking move, it would be susceptible.
 

Eifie

oh man, good times.
Pronoun
she/her
Also, can something like Encore be affected by accuracy drops? It doesn't seem like it should, but it has 100% accuracy instead of -- accuracy, and if it was an attacking move, it would be susceptible.
Yes, anything with a number for accuracy should be affected by accuracy drops. You'd probably flavour it as something like, the Pokémon starts clapping and cheering at thin air, or something, and then the opponent is all "uhhhh, what?" and is totally unaffected.
 

Sandstone-Shadow

A chickadee in love with the sky
Pronoun
she/her
Questions involving Link Cables, Trace, Pickup, and Knock Off:

So a Link Cable grants the holder Trace right away at the beginning of the battle. Trace then immediately copies Pickup (in this case) in addition to the holder's original ability. Right? Or does the additional Trace ability override the holder's original ability?

Next, if the Link Cable is Knocked Off, does the Link Cable's holder immediately lose Trace and Pickup?

Then, can Pickup pick up an item that was knocked off? As in, can the original Pickup user now pick up the Link Cable (if they're not holding anything else)? If so, can they use Trace?
 

Keldeo

Resolute
Pronoun
he, they
What are the circumstances of failure that cause Stomping Tantrum's base power to increase? In game, it's apparently only when the move produces a "But it failed!" message or when it hits an immune or no target, which I think would disqualify paralysis/sleep, flinching, hitting oneself in confusion, and immobilization due to attraction. The power also doesn't go up when the failed move is launched into Protect. However, the flavor text for ASB seems to imply the power increases after any source of failure that causes the move to "fail to land"; does that differ from the in-game circumstances, and would that also include misses?
 

Negrek

busy dizzy lazy
Staff member
For energy calculation purposes, does "never missing" (Swift, Magical Leaf, etc) count as a secondary effect? I feel like it doesn't count.
Currently it doesn't, although I think it might be beneficial to put the energy increase on those, too, in the future.

Questions involving Link Cables, Trace, Pickup, and Knock Off:

So a Link Cable grants the holder Trace right away at the beginning of the battle. Trace then immediately copies Pickup (in this case) in addition to the holder's original ability. Right? Or does the additional Trace ability override the holder's original ability?

Next, if the Link Cable is Knocked Off, does the Link Cable's holder immediately lose Trace and Pickup?

Then, can Pickup pick up an item that was knocked off? As in, can the original Pickup user now pick up the Link Cable (if they're not holding anything else)? If so, can they use Trace?
Correct, link cable trace grants the pokémon an extra ability instead of overwriting the native ability. The second ability is lost as soon as the pokémon loses the link cable.

The pickup pokémon doesn't automatically pick the link cable up, but if it has no item and chooses to do so, it would gain trace, and trace would copy an ability at the end of that action. Likewise, if the pokémon originally holding the link cable picked it back up, it would re-gain trace, and trace would also fire at the end of that action. In a doubles or greater match, it would have the potential to trace a different ability than it did the first time.

What are the circumstances of failure that cause Stomping Tantrum's base power to increase? In game, it's apparently only when the move produces a "But it failed!" message or when it hits an immune or no target, which I think would disqualify paralysis/sleep, flinching, hitting oneself in confusion, and immobilization due to attraction. The power also doesn't go up when the failed move is launched into Protect. However, the flavor text for ASB seems to imply the power increases after any source of failure that causes the move to "fail to land"; does that differ from the in-game circumstances, and would that also include misses?
I think we can expand the triggers beyond what they are in-game, at ref's discretion. Getting frustrated over a missed attack, protected attack, etc. seems reasonable. If that makes it too abusable somehow, we can revisit.
 

Sandstone-Shadow

A chickadee in love with the sky
Pronoun
she/her
If a round ends mid-action, what happens to the distribution of Toxic poison? Normally it accrues throughout the round - does it suddenly all get shifted to whatever actions take place, or does the Pokemon take less Toxic damage than it should for that round?

I'm thinking increase severity as normal for the next round?
 

Negrek

busy dizzy lazy
Staff member
Generally I split toxic out across actions anyway... so if overall toxic's supposed to be at 3% per round, it does 1% action one, another 1% action two, etc. So if the round cuts off early, you just take health away for however many actions their actually are. For cases where toxic's at something other than a multiple of three, I think a good rule of thumb in a truncated round would be to multiply the total damage for the round by (number of actions)/3 and round to the nearest percent to get the amount toxic should do.

So if toxic is at 5%/round and the round ends in the second action, toxic should overall do 5 * (2/3) per action = 3% for that round. On the other hand, if the round ends on the first action and toxic is at 4%, it would do 4 * (1/3) = 1% damage.

It should increase in severity the next round as normal.
 

Negrek

busy dizzy lazy
Staff member
Generally I split toxic out across actions anyway... so if overall toxic's supposed to be at 3% per round, it does 1% action one, another 1% action two, etc. So if the round cuts off early, you just take health away for however many actions their actually are. For cases where toxic's at something other than a multiple of three, I think a good rule of thumb in a truncated round would be to multiply the total damage for the round by (number of actions)/3 and round to the nearest percent to get the amount toxic should do.

So if toxic is at 5%/round and the round ends in the second action, toxic should overall do 5 * (2/3) per action = 3% for that round. On the other hand, if the round ends on the first action and toxic is at 4%, it would do 4 * (1/3) = 1% damage.

It should increase in severity the next round as normal.
 

Eifie

oh man, good times.
Pronoun
she/her
Why is Rain Dish so much worse than Ice Body? They have the same effect (in their respective weathers) during the game, don't they?

For reference: Rain Dish restores 1% health and energy per round during which it was raining (unclear how much of the round has to be spent in rain for this to happen), while Ice Body restores 2% health per action in hail.
 

Eifie

oh man, good times.
Pronoun
she/her
Should Role Play actually cost 5% energy, because it's a long-duration effect? iirc the 3% in the database was a placeholder energy value for status moves that didn't obviously fit into one of the categories in the damage guide.
 

Sandstone-Shadow

A chickadee in love with the sky
Pronoun
she/her
Does Uproar wake up any Pokemon already asleep?

If a Pokemon is forced awake from a Rest sleep (if that's even possible - not sure if there are any other moves that could potentially awaken a sleeping pokemon), what happens to the health restored? Does the Pokemon lose out on what it would have gained during the rest of sleep, gain it all at once, or gain it normally even though they're awake?
 
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