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Communism?

Yeah, except

1) they had no freedom
2) they had to repress pretty much everything about themselves
3) they were living a total lie which probably resulted in depression which they then had to repress
4) they weren't allowed to experience fun things (sex)
5) their lives were meaningless
 
No, they wouldn't know. Jonas /felt/ he had freedom, at least until he became Receiver. But he always felt that if he didn't have the freedom for a certain thing that the elders would make a better choice anyway, and it made him feel relieved. And he didn't know what "the pill" was either, so I don't think 2 applies.

This is now a book club.
 
This is now a book club.
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Then I may I suggest Chinese Whispers by Hsiao-Hung Pai? It's about Chinese immigrants who sneak into England and the sort of lives they lead. Trust me, it's not glamorous. They talk about why they left communist China to have the worst jobs in the country, being paid below minimum wage and working ridiculous hours.

Information is really deadly over there, as they try to blend communism into their history and erase brutal events that have occurred by their own hand against their own people.

And on that note, Animal Farm. Read it.
 
Well you have to realize that anyone in such a society would have thoughts like "I wish I could just _______" where either the rules or social norms dictate that they can't. In the world of the Giver these thoughts would presumably become far more common than they are with us (and they are pretty common with us) because less things are allowed. This would certainly lead to feeling a lack of freedom, which would then lead to them repressing these thoughts. Even if the characters in the book didn't feel this, realistically they would. Plus there's the fact that biologically, when people reach the age of 14 or so they naturally want to rebel. This of course isn't gone over in the book but presumably some teens would really fell the lack of freedom they had during this stage, possibly even continuing to adulthood. Also someone would probably stop taking the pill just for the hell of it and then start fucking someone. :\

Also living in a world so structured and sugar-coated would rapidly lead to depression, I feel like.

edit: also re the above post animal farm's moral is exclusively about corruption. the communist aspect of it is incidental. orwell was a socialist. not sure if you knew this or not but ok.
 
Actually pretty sure Orwell was really confused about his economical orientation when he wrote that book, but either way it perfectly portrays communism.

1984... bejeezus. Big brother is watching you. *shivers*
 
Orwell wrote Animal Farm in fear that Communism would spread to England. I studied it in high school and that's the background the teacher gave us. Socialism =/= Communism.
 
Guys these are all really famous/successful books you're recommending. It's rather redundant. Like saying 'hey you should check out the internet it's a cool place'.
 
Pentimento said:
Guys these are all really famous/successful books you're recommending. It's rather redundant. Like saying 'hey you should check out the internet it's a cool place'.
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this would be a valid criticism, except that a lot of young people are appallingly ignorant of literature. :|
 
What's sad is that the quality of life in Russia was better under the USSR than now. As in, more people had houses, jobs, a longer life expectancy and less alcoholism. Then everyone celebrates the fall in the early 90s and now they lead worse lives and they didn't even gain freedom of speech.

I think that's pretty depressing considering 40 years ago even high-placed families had to make their own shoes.
 
Ruby said:
I don't know why everyone assumes that humans are bastards. It doesn't correspond with my day-to-day experience.
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It's a fairly uniquely Western intellectual hang up. Eastern cultures and especially indigenous cultures do not hold the same view of "human nature"(i take a great deal of issue with the term itself but anyway). The first human societies practiced collective ownership and had an egalitarian social structure, as can still be seen in hunter-gather societies that exist today. Obviously the habits of the first human social groups will afford you a good idea of what "human nature" actually is, and it is far closer to communism than capitalism.

As far as the adage that communism "fails in practice" I would have to consider it the most impressive failure in human history. Communism and a government-run economy turned the backwater and laughing stock of the Western world, Tsarist Russia, into an astounding industrial power in a few short years - to the point of being one of the two Superpowers in the world post-WWII despite taking the most damage of any nation in the war. Its industrial growth until the Brezhnev years was unparalleled in capitalist economies. Increases in life expectancy, literacy and education were all enormous. If you want to talk about standards of living metrics, communism is a miracle. Maoist China saw the greatest increase in life expectancy in human history, as well as staggering increases in literacy. Maoist China finally modernized the nation; and although the true economic growth doesn't come until Deng Xiaoping's market-based reforms, you would have to be insane to believe that those reforms would have had a hope of working if Communism had not pulled China into the 20th century at a breakneck pace.
 
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