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Forum Revival TV Tropes Mafia Revival - D7

On the bright side, if speculation's right and Jack was mafia doc AND Boquise was some sort of mafia based on his role trope, then we're down two already?

But that seems unlikely, who is surgical-striking all these damn mafia.
 
so i'm just making sure i'm actually on the same page. doesn't this confirm that jack was mafia or that flavor/flip was messed with? we know neg's claim is real now that she's been verified by VM, probably. so. this could mean jack was taken down? :D

(uh. how though. lucky vig? maybe i'm just behind/not keeping up with you guys oops)
 
mewtini said:
doesn't this confirm that jack was mafia or that flavor/flip was messed with?
Click to expand...

So since VM only takes non-mafia roles and didn't get Jack's role, Jack had to have been mafia. We don't know if it's something in his role that made him flip as innocent (which could be likely), or if the flavor text/flip itself got modified by the mafia (also likely, if the mafia are able to "pull the strings" as Seshas said).
 
cool! so that's a good one down for us. in that case i am now curious about the mode of death tbh, especially since it's similar maybe (read: not bloody) to boq's ... these are kind of unsettling
 
mewtini said:
so i'm just making sure i'm actually on the same page. doesn't this confirm that jack was mafia or that flavor/flip was messed with? we know neg's claim is real now that she's been verified by VM, probably. so. this could mean jack was taken down? :D

(uh. how though. lucky vig? maybe i'm just behind/not keeping up with you guys oops)
Click to expand...
I don't think it's confirmed. The way I see it, there are many ways we could have arrived here (in no particular order):

1. VM's lying completely about his power and its results
2. Jack was actually mafia and therefore didn't trigger VM's power on the first night
2a. Jack was some mafia-aligned or otherwise not sufficiently Town role that flips innocent regardless
2b. The flip was somehow doctored
2c. Someone blocked/redirected/something during the night in such a way that Jack flipped innocent even though he wasn't, he was innocent "at the time of role reveal" but somehow became mafia afterwards and before VM's power was triggered. Basically depends on where VM's power comes in Butterfree's nightly order of operations.
3. VM's power was somehow blocked on the first night and therefore only procced the first time when ILS died
4. VM's power was somehow altered/redirected/otherwise messed with last night, causing weirdness to happen
5. My power was somehow messed with N0

Okay, I lied, it is in order: I think one or two are the most likely. But I can't choose between them at the moment.
 
Ok longpost bc meatspace pulled me for a bit

Negrek said:
I will respond to actual discussion later, but can we not do the cop cover thing? I get that it's supposed to give us reliable alignment reads if the cop dies before they can claim, but we are not going to know when the cop dies. I don't see it doing anything for us outside of helping narrow down who's an actual cop for the mafia.

Unless I'm missing something! But if I'm understanding the strategy correctly, it seems like something that makes sense in a game where roles are revealed on death but which is Bad for a setup like this.
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You are right. I won’t hypo n1 anymore, nor any other further n (although I’ll stand by my n0 hypo for consistency’s sake). Besides, unless I’m missing something, nobody in their right mind would hypo somebody red unless a) actually a cop or b) heavily wanting to throw shade, so

Negrek said:
To be honest, I had completely discounted the possibility of Jack secretly being Mafia, but it seems I've come down to either Jack's secretly mafia or VM's lying, so.
Click to expand...
I’d say maybe Jack was (mafia-leaning?) 3p and his win condition would be something on the lines of infecting everybody with something, but VM said his role PM explicitly said “not mafia”, so yeah
Negrek said:
On the bright side, if speculation's right and Jack was mafia doc AND Boquise was some sort of mafia based on his role trope, then we're down two already?

But that seems unlikely, who is surgical-striking all these damn mafia.
Click to expand...
Maybe there is indeed an OP townie out there and this whole game is just Butterfree laughing at the expense of the mafia’s misery and despair trying to track the spying sniper :^)
mewtini said:
so i'm just making sure i'm actually on the same page. doesn't this confirm that jack was mafia or that flavor/flip was messed with? we know neg's claim is real now that she's been verified by VM, probably. so. this could mean jack was taken down? :D

(uh. how though. lucky vig? maybe i'm just behind/not keeping up with you guys oops)
Click to expand...
Or maybe VM was somehow roleblocked? Although yeah, I reckon that wouldn’t make much sense thinking back on it
 
rari_teh said:
Or maybe VM was somehow roleblocked?
Click to expand...
i mentioned this in super early game when it came up (before VM knew that his role was night-acting, not day-after-kill acting) and negrek commented that it sounds like a passive/not roleblockable which i might be on board with
 
rari_teh said:
How so?
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full disclosure that i do not know the intricate parts of mafia such as this, haha, but
Negrek said:
can we not do the cop cover thing? I get that it's supposed to give us reliable alignment reads if the cop dies before they can claim, but we are not going to know when the cop dies. I don't see it doing anything for us outside of helping narrow down who's an actual cop for the mafia.
Click to expand...
i agree w kyeugh that this is probably hard since mafia will have to triangulate from existing cop covers, but the way i read it is that you just totally anti-hypocopped, narrowing down possibilities
 
Also idk if I can ask this outside this thread bc it kinda relates to mafia but it’s also not directly about mafia, so I’ll take the safe option of asking it here anyway

Why doesn’t Mawile appear online even though he just posted? Is it a result of posting on mobile/funny cookie bug or something?
 
don't mean to scold you though. i just don't really know how stuff like this works
 
rari_teh said:
Also idk if I can ask this outside this thread bc it kinda relates to mafia but it’s also not directly about mafia, so I’ll take the safe option of asking it here anyway

Why doesn’t Mawile appear online even though he just posted? Is it a result of posting on mobile/funny cookie bug or something?
Click to expand...
some people set their activity visibility to be invisible! so you can't see when they're online
 
I can’t even see how that could be taken as a scolding tbh lol

mewtini said:
full disclosure that i do not know the intricate parts of mafia such as this, haha, but

i agree w kyeugh that this is probably hard since mafia will have to triangulate from existing cop covers, but the way i read it is that you just totally anti-hypocopped, narrowing down possibilities
Click to expand...
Nobody knows even whether an actual cop hypocopped at any given point or not, so yeah, I still don’t follow?
 
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