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A slow process

Bellsprout

Bellsprout

New member
So, I'm trying to design a Rain Dance team. Only got one completely mapped out. C+C please.

ACCELGOR
Timid / Hydration @ Leftovers/Focus Sash
Bug Buzz / Recover / Giga Drain / Guard Split
252 HP / 96 Sp.ATT / 160 SPD​

The move set feels a little weak, as does the gimmick as a whole, but I really want to play around with this thing. After it wrecked my Serperior so much when I was facing Alder, I've wanted to do something with it. The idea is to get low IV's in Defenses, use Guard Split on whatever comes in (obviously prefer something with naturally high Defenses), and then prepare to wreck/stall with two to three methods of recovery (depending on if I use Leftovers). Hydration keeps its status healthy in the rain. The EV spread (assuming 31 SPD IV) allows it to outspeed everything except Ninjask, Electrode, and three forms of Deoxys. So, between that and Focus Sash (which is what I'm leaning toward with all that recovery going on), I can pretty much guarantee setting up Guard Split. I only fear Fire and Flying, and Fire not so much if rain is supporting me. Not sure if I want to use this as a lead or maybe even a surprise late-game sweeper, though.
 
I'll help out with your team later.

If this takes place in doubles, I highly suggest either switching to Shuckle if you want to use Guard Split. It's not worth risking your defenses, you can just use Guard Split on your sweeper (which is why Shuckle is a good idea, as it would match the Defense stat with 300-some).

If you decide to do the above, get rid of Guard Split and put Rain Dance there.

Next up is Blastoise. It has decent defenses, enough for a Rain Dance team. It can also get Rain Dish as a Dream World ability (if it's released yet).

It never hurts to have two Pokemon to set up Rain Dance.

Blastoise@Leftovers
(Nature)
Torrent/Rain Dish
252 HP, 252 Sp. Defense, 4 Attack / 252 HP, 252 Sp. Attack, 4 Sp. Attack
- Rain Dance/Toxic
- Rapid Spin
- Dragon Tail
- Hydro Pump/Aqua Tail

Spikes, Stealth Rock, etc. are becoming more common these days, and Blastoise is a nice Pokemon that can do a few jobs.
Rain Dance for setting up, Toxic for stalling out. I would choose Toxic if you use Drizzle Politoed. Rapid Spin to get rid of rocks and spikes, Dragon Tail allows Blastoise to be a phazer so no one can set up on you. Hydro Pump and Aqua Tail are personal preference, either works.

I'd also suggest Ludicolo because of Swift Swim/Rain Dish, I'll get to a set on that.

And by the way, just remember Drizzle+Swift Swim is banned, I believe.
 
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Thanks for the heads up.

I had also thought about utilizing the Guard Split alongside Shuckles in doubles as well, but since I was working on the Rain Dance team in my head, the fact that Accelgor couldn't be affected by status was very appealing considering that'd be one less element of its frailty to worry about. And by reducing the opponent's Defenses to have them match my own, the idea was that Bug Buzz and Giga Drain would be that much more potent in the end. Perhaps this is a 'meh' design in the end, but the gimmick still greatly appeals to me.

As for the Blastoise, it sounds good. If I could get a legit Rain Dish one, obviously I'd prefer that, cuz chances are I will go for Drizzle 'toed.

As for the ban, I personally think it's stupid. People still use Drought/Chlorophyll like it's going out of style and I haven't heard one word about that. Or Sand Stream/Rush. Or even Hail/Snow Cloak (and Evasion is more heavily frowned upon than these Weather/Speed conditions). But, anyway, I'm getting offtopic.

Thanks for your input on the Blastoise.
 
I agree that the Drizzle + Swift Swim ban is ridiculous, considering how broken sand is compared to the other weathers.
 
Raaaiiiiinnnnn....Hmmm

Well theres both Peliper and Swanna from DW, and access to Hurricane in the rain is good. Also some possibilities with Lanturn, especially due to it being one of the few pokemon who resist the Ice/Electric combo, as well a Rain Thunder and so on and so forth.
 
Politoed@Leftovers / Choice Scarf / Life Orb / Focus Sash
(Nature) -I would either go for +Speed or +Sp. Defense-
Drizzle
252 Speed, 252 Attack, 4 Sp. Attack / 252 Speed, 252 Sp. Attack, 4 Attack / 252 Defense, 252 Sp. Defense, 4 HP
- Earthquake
- Perish Song/Bulldoze
- Scald/Surf
- Ice Beam

Politoed makes a decent Special Wall. It can't make full use of it's Defense stat because it's horribly low, so there's no point in really investing any EVs on it. It's better to invest it in Speed, so it can at least have a Speed tie with Jolteon, providing it has a +Speed nature and 252 Speed EVs. Choice Scarf allows you to outspeed Jolteon. Without a Choice Scarf, it can still outspeed every Electric-type except Jolteon that isn't scarfed or has some sort of speed boost (other than Electrode, who clocks at 416 Speed max. Scarf should allow you to outspeed even Electrode). You can also outspeed pretty much every Grass Type, so you are literally guaranteed to move first against those two types.

Earthquake is there to take out any Electric types and for diversity. Perish Song is for phazing, but I suggest using it on the last set of EVs, the defensive set. Go for Bulldoze on the offensive sets (the first two) if you want to ensure you stay faster. It's better without a Choice Scarf, but really works fine either way (allowing you to outspeed Electrode, if you survive with that horrible defense stat).

Scald allows you to take a hit if you get a burn with it, while doing decent damage. Surf is straightforward. Personal preference.

Ice Beam is there to make the Grass-types flee the city. Straight-forward.

EDIT: DAMMIT I JUST NOTICED POLITOED'S SPEED IS KINDA SUCKY! SCARF IT, MAN! And disregard all that Speed crap at the top.



Ludicolo will probably be nice for this team, it's pretty bulky, decently powerful, and a nice receiver from Rain Dish.
 
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Dapper Deathclaw said:
Raaaiiiiinnnnn....Hmmm

Well theres both Peliper and Swanna from DW, and access to Hurricane in the rain is good. Also some possibilities with Lanturn, especially due to it being one of the few pokemon who resist the Ice/Electric combo, as well a Rain Thunder and so on and so forth.
Click to expand...

All right. That explains how effective a general Rain Dance strategy is, but it hardly explains why Drizzle/Swift Swim is singled out as opposed to all the other weather effect/stat-altering ability combos out there.
 
Actually, if it gets Guard swap, it would be even better. But I'm too lazy to look. What I can notice however, is that Focus Blast is a very valuable option over Giga Drain considering Bug Buzz and Giga Drain's redundant coverage.
 
I agree with you on Focus Blast's better type coverage. But, frankly, its accuracy scares me.

As for Guard Swap, I would use that over Guard Split except -the way I understand it, at least- Guard Split averages out the Defense stats whereas Guard Swap switches the stat changes, not the stats themselves. That's relying too much on the opponent for my taste.
 
Just gonna come on in here and suggest Rotom-W and then leave. It's a good special sweeper, and I'm pretty sure its S.Atk is higher than Lanturn's. Lanturn has Volt Absorb, which I guess is alright, but it's the only ability people will be expecting you to use. So they likely won't be throwing Electric attacks at you. Rotom-W, on the other hand, has Levitate, which means it is only weak to Grass.

Just sayin.
 
lanturn has, overall, more bulk (and stockpile or swallow for boosting or somewhat unreliable healing), and can get np-coverage without relying on hydro pump or hidden power, and ice is still a great type to have access to. offense is really not the point of lanturn, though, and being bulky helps. levitate is probably more useful in general, though, yes.
 
Bellsprout said:
I agree with you on Focus Blast's better type coverage. But, frankly, its accuracy scares me.

As for Guard Swap, I would use that over Guard Split except -the way I understand it, at least- Guard Split averages out the Defense stats whereas Guard Swap switches the stat changes, not the stats themselves. That's relying too much on the opponent for my taste.
Click to expand...

Argh, thought guard swap switched the defense stats. sorry

@sreservoir: Rotom is waay bulkier physically, as well as a superior recovery move in Pain Split and beter support moves Like WoW, Trick, Screens, etc.
 
I do believe 97610 maximum hp*def is greater than 76912. 79% as much is really not waay bulkier, although the moves are better, yes. (heal bell is nifty, though, if not necessarily useful.)
 
considering wonder room has -7 priority, and everything that learns it other than mismagius (which should probably not be taking enough hits for it to matter, without some trickery) has, at most, a 20 base difference in defenses, wonder room seems a marvelous waste of a turn and a move slot. if it didn't have that terrible priority, and something like blissey learned it, it would still probably be a waste of a turn and a move slot.
 
Switching it up completely...I've recently gotten some inspiration for a Sun team, and I've got two individuals that I find are rather unique in their design. Constructive criticism only, please. I can't get better through blatant insults.

VICTREEBEL
Victreebel [Special Sunny Variant]
Modest/Chlorophyll @ Lum Berry
Solarbeam / Hidden Power [Rock] / Weather Ball / Sunny Day
252 Sp.ATT / 252 SPD

Strategy is rather elementary. Sunny Day works threefold for Victreebel to transform it into a rather nasty special sweeper that can hit with a 1-turn, base 180 move, counter three of its four weaknesses, and even has an answer to Grass and Steel types. Lum Berry ensures Victreebel doesn't get screwed by PRZ.

TORKOAL
Torkoal [Toxi-Trap Variant]
Relaxed/White Smoke @ Grip Claw/Leftovers/Rocky Helmet
Fire Spin / Curse / Gyro Ball / Toxic
252 HP / 252 DEF

Gimmicky, yes. Fire Spin+Toxic is the main draw for me here. Torkoal is more meant to take on walls (or perhaps even physical sweepers), and in the Sun, it only has two real threats: Rock and Ground, both predominantly physical. Curse ensures minimal damage from physical attacks with synergy to power up Gyro Ball twofold (+ATT/-SPD) in case Torkoal becomes victim to Taunt. Item is up to personal preference...​
 
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