Educational Funding Disparity?

[Superbird]

For example, no white child today questions the presence of black children in his or her school; during my grandparents time this idea was socially liberal and at the least criticized heavily.

And yet, my school district is about to pretty much fall apart because of an inverted case. See, apparently, out school system was one of the best in the country because of the 'diversity program' that bussed people all over the city so that there was /variety/ in every school. Now the conservatives who somehow got ahold of the school board want to change this. I think they're just racist and don't want their precious children making friends with poor black people.

Which is bull****.

 

[Pwnemon]

Re: Political Compass

And yet, my school district is about to pretty much fall apart because of an inverted case. See, apparently, out school system was one of the best in the country because of the 'diversity program' that bussed people all over the city so that there was /variety/ in every school. Now the conservatives who somehow got ahold of the school board want to change this. I think they're just racist and don't want their precious children making friends with poor black people.

Which is bull****.

Yet most of the early arguments against such bussing programs were not "I'M RACIST LOL" but rather, "I paid a lot for a house in this nice school system and I don't want my kids to have to get bussed into a gang zone with a horrible school."

 

[Superbird]

Re: Political Compass

That's the thing. There are no schools that are horrible. In fact, the better ones happen to be in these "gang zone" areas.

 

[Crazy Linoone]

Re: Political Compass

Yet most of the early arguments against such bussing programs were not "I'M RACIST LOL" but rather, "I paid a lot for a house in this nice school system and I don't want my kids to have to get bussed into a gang zone with a horrible school."

But that's still racist, because black people do not automatically equal to gangsters, and getting rid of black people isn't necessarily going to get rid of the gang problem because the white kids at the school might be the gangsters and the poor black people have nothing to do with it. It's not like getting rid off all the black people will suddenly make all the white people become BFFS 4EVER.

 

[Pwnemon]

Re: Political Compass

But that's still racist, because black people do not automatically equal to gangsters, and getting rid of black people isn't necessarily going to get rid of the gang problem because the white kids at the school might be the gangsters and the poor black people have nothing to do with it. It's not like getting rid off all the black people will suddenly make all the white people become BFFS 4EVER.

Did I say, "I DONT WANT BUSSED TO BLACK SCHOOLS" no i didn't. I just said that there's a few rotten apples in every barrel and how would you feel if you paid for a home in a good school system and then got bussed to some crap school.

 

[Espeon]

Re: Political Compass

Did I say, "I DONT WANT BUSSED TO BLACK SCHOOLS" no i didn't. I just said that there's a few rotten apples in every barrel and how would you feel if you paid for a home in a good school system and then got bussed to some crap school.

And yet here you're implying that schools with a high population of coloured children are inherently crap? People shouldn't be allowed to pay money in order to have better educations, health care and soforth. Everyone should be entitled to the same basic rights such as education irrespective of their incomes, their social status, class, race, gender and soforth. At the end of the day, we're all human and no amount of money can change that.

 

[Pwnemon]

Re: Political Compass

And yet here you're implying that schools with a high population of coloured children are inherently crap? People shouldn't be allowed to pay money in order to have better educations, health care and soforth. Everyone should be entitled to the same basic rights such as education irrespective of their incomes, their social status, class, race, gender and soforth. At the end of the day, we're all human and no amount of money can change that.

you're right. that's exactly what i'm implying. because everybody knows the entire point of bussing is to send white children to black schools and vacate the white schools.

 

[Crazy Linoone]

Re: Political Compass

Did I say, "I DONT WANT BUSSED TO BLACK SCHOOLS" no i didn't. I just said that there's a few rotten apples in every barrel and how would you feel if you paid for a home in a good school system and then got bussed to some crap school.

If I'm actually misreading your posts, then I honestly apologize. However, I feel like you are implying racist comments, inadvertently or not, and I will attempt to explain my reasoning and hopefully we can figure out whether you're actually racist and do not realize it or I somehow missed your points.

See, apparently, out school system was one of the best in the country because of the 'diversity program' that bussed people all over the city so that there was /variety/ in every school. Now the conservatives who somehow got ahold of the school board want to change this. I think they're just racist and don't want their precious children making friends with poor black people.

Yet most of the early arguments against such bussing programs were not "I'M RACIST LOL" but rather, "I paid a lot for a house in this nice school system and I don't want my kids to have to get bussed into a gang zone with a horrible school."

So, from what I understand, Superbird's bussing* system results in schools with relatively equal numbers of white and black people instead of having a school with mostly blacks, a school with mostly whites, etc.

You replied to this post by putting up an argument against bussing, that nobody want their children in gang zones. The racist vibes I'm getting is mainly from here: Superbird never mentioned gangs or horrible schools, only "poor black people". Poor black people do not automatically to gangs or horrible schools. Thinking that black == gangs is racist (If you can't see why, then you're racist).

The "Yet" in your sentence implies that your second claim ("I paid a lot for a house in this nice school system and I don't want my kids to have to get bussed into a gang zone with a horrible school.") is different from the first claim ("IM RACIST LOL"), aka not racist. As I've pointed out that the second claim is actually a racist statement, I feel like you're racist and do not realize your racism.

*I'm just going to use "bussing" because I have no idea if there's an actual word for it.

you're right. that's exactly what i'm implying. because everybody knows the entire point of bussing is to send white children to black schools and vacate the white schools.

So yeah. Either you are subconsciously racist, or I have no idea what you're implying. :P

 

[ultraviolet]

Re: Political Compass

I just said that there's a few rotten apples in every barrel and how would you feel if you paid for a home in a good school system and then got bussed to some crap school.

has anyone here actually been to a school where there weren't horrible kids or gangs or bullies? do you think the crap schools are crap because... only children from lower-income families go there? I get the impression that you're not really thinking about this on a larger scale. isn't it better to try and set something up that will eventually benefit everyone (or most people) than just the rich?

 

[Pwnemon]

Re: Political Compass

If I'm actually misreading your posts, then I honestly apologize. However, I feel like you are implying racist comments, inadvertently or not, and I will attempt to explain my reasoning and hopefully we can figure out whether you're actually racist and do not realize it or I somehow missed your points.

So, from what I understand, Superbird's bussing* system results in schools with relatively equal numbers of white and black people instead of having a school with mostly blacks, a school with mostly whites, etc.

You replied to this post by putting up an argument against bussing, that nobody want their children in gang zones. The racist vibes I'm getting is mainly from here: Superbird never mentioned gangs or horrible schools, only "poor black people". Poor black people do not automatically to gangs or horrible schools. Thinking that black == gangs is racist (If you can't see why, then you're racist).

The "Yet" in your sentence implies that your second claim ("I paid a lot for a house in this nice school system and I don't want my kids to have to get bussed into a gang zone with a horrible school.") is different from the first claim ("IM RACIST LOL"), aka not racist. As I've pointed out that the second claim is actually a racist statement, I feel like you're racist and do not realize your racism.

*I'm just going to use "bussing" because I have no idea if there's an actual word for it.

So yeah. Either you are subconsciously racist, or I have no idea what you're implying. :P

Superbird said that the reason that the bussing program was ended was because the people are racist. I tried to point out to him that the main opposition against bussing programs was not at all based upon race, but rather class, although looking back my arguments do seem very ambiguous. And the last thing you quoted was me being sarcastic.

has anyone here actually been to a school where there weren't horrible kids or gangs or bullies? do you think the crap schools are crap because... only children from lower-income families go there? I get the impression that you're not really thinking about this on a larger scale. isn't it better to try and set something up that will eventually benefit everyone (or most people) than just the rich?

Unless i'm mistaken, by trying to maintain an equal quota, you're disbenefiting just as much rich as you are benefiting poor people. Wouldn't it be better to let everyone go to their own school systems and just fund and staff them all around the same?

 

[Adriane]

Re: Political Compass

Unless i'm mistaken, by trying to maintain an equal quota, you're disbenefiting just as much rich as you are benefiting poor people. Wouldn't it be better to let everyone go to their own school systems and just fund and staff them all around the same?

So the rich stay richer and the poor stay poorer? As someone aspiring to become a teacher, I honestly don't want to teach here in South Carolina -- the schools are awful, the pay is bad.

 

[Aisling]

by suggestion of newt, this derailing of that Political Compass thread will now be redirected here.

Give me a few moments to move related posts from that thread to this one...

 

[Pwnemon]

Re: Political Compass

So the rich stay richer and the poor stay poorer? As someone aspiring to become a teacher, I honestly don't want to teach here in South Carolina -- the schools are awful, the pay is bad.

Starting to suspect the communication gap here is Pwnemon not knowing that the different districts don't all have the same funding. The argument that doing what he is suggesting might contribute to furthering inequality might strike him as totally alien.

But yeah: The districts that are, say, projects? (Or, as Vixie suggests, the entire state of South Carolina?) They aren't collecting the money needed to run a good school. This is why people who live in those places will try to send their kids to other places.

So if an entire district/state is poor, i can see how that would increase a rich/poor rift, but what I don't see is how bussing people around a district is going to help that problem if every school is at a consistently horrible level. If anything, wouldn't it just spend money that could be put in other parts of the budget to improve the schools?

 

[Aisling]

Okay uh, that should do it! Anyway

So the rich stay richer and the poor stay poorer? As someone aspiring to become a teacher, I honestly don't want to teach here in South Carolina -- the schools are awful, the pay is bad.

Same here, and I'm just learning more and more about how awful it is in AP Gov, since we talk about relevant issues and all and there's that thing going on in Wisconsin. I mean, in Tennessee you don't even have to go to college to be a teacher! I mean just wtf, South.

also should this be in srs bsns? Other mods feel free to move but we've had more heated threads in Misc. Disc. so I guess it's fine

 

[Crazy Linoone]

Re: Political Compass

So if an entire district/state is poor, i can see how that would increase a rich/poor rift, but what I don't see is how bussing people around a district is going to help that problem if every school is at a consistently horrible level. If anything, wouldn't it just spend money that could be put in other parts of the budget to improve the schools?

That's the thing. There are no schools that are horrible. In fact, the better ones happen to be in these "gang zone" areas.

 

[Aisling]

So if an entire district/state is poor, i can see how that would increase a rich/poor rift, but what I don't see is how bussing people around a district is going to help that problem if every school is at a consistently horrible level. If anything, wouldn't it just spend money that could be put in other parts of the budget to improve the schools?

That's the thing. There are no schools that are horrible. In fact, the better ones happen to be in these "gang zone" areas.

uh, see

That's the thing. There are no schools that are horrible. In fact, the better ones happen to be in these "gang zone" areas.

protip: newt's picture links to an article which is perfectly contrary to Superbird's statement so you might want to think twice about quoting Superbird to counter Pwnemon's post bro

 

[Superbird]

Amendment to the previous statement. No schools in the district in question are actually bad schools. It's just that some of the better ones (mine, as an example) happen to be right in the middle of a "gang zone" in an African-american neighborhood. I've actually never seen any gangs there, and I cannot remember a single code-red lockdown that was not "just a drill", so...

Summary: Elaborating on my situation.

 

[Aisling]

That doesn't mean all schools in gang zones are better than schools not in gang zones...?

 

[Superbird]

As far as I know, they're all about the same. It depends on whether you want sports, academics, arts..

 

[Crazy Linoone]

protip: newt's picture links to an article which is perfectly contrary to Superbird's statement so you might want to think twice about quoting Superbird to counter Pwnemon's post bro

Uh, I was actually trying to point out that "horrible schools in gang zones" don't apply to Superbird, whose school district is the topic of the discussion right now. I'm not trying say that all schools in gang zones are good or there are no terrible schools.