Homosexuality

[xxxbloodysoul666xxx]

also for the record i'm straight, but i'll be damned if any group of people will be discriminated against for something like this

:sweatdrop:

Thanks

 

[Philly]

I concur, Homosexuality is nothing to be discriminated against for.

 

[xxxbloodysoul666xxx]

I concur, Homosexuality is nothing to be discriminated against for.

Church, probably, but the law?

That is just ridiculous.

 

[Valor]

It's called sarcasm. Live with it.

You are not allowed to be sarcastic. Hand over any sarcasm points you have now and leave the area immediately.

It. Was. Lying. Crap. I'm Mormon, okay? I know what we do and what we don't do. Got it?

Nope, sorry, that is wrong. Thanks for playing, though. By the way, back when Polygamy was accepted, the wives of a man could be considered married to the other women, sooooo... Hmm, interesting. Plus, I'm sure the man wasn't going to be that great in the future. Did they tell you about the large numbers of teen Mormons that kill themselves? No? What about the adultery that goes on? Really? No? Hm. Wonder why.

I don't know; maybe the sources are biased. Give. Me. Proof.
If I see proof that the sources are biased and that the information is junk, then maybe I'll believe you guys.

Does it matter? You're essentially biased to your religion.

You may not like it, but it's because of my religion. Feel free to call that invalid, but it isn't.

Your religion is invalid. WHOOPS I'M PREJUDICE.

On a broader scale, I do not find having homosexual feelings to be wrong. Many people have them without a choice. However, I find expressing those feelings to be wrong, just like I find things like adultery to be wrong. Sexual feelings are mainly for one purpose on a broad scale of things: reproduction. Bringing new life onto this Earth. Expressing them in other ways is wrong.

Really? Do you HAVE to bring that argument up? What the HELL is the point of saying "Oh, you can have those feelings, you just can't act on them! LOLOLOL"? That is completely restrictive to gays and lesbians that actually have a more opened mind than plenty of America.

Matriarchal societies have existed. Some societies were against equal rights, some weren't. Also, women are not a way of thinking. They are a gender. To say that because women deserve equal rights, gays deserve equal rights is an inaccurate point of view.

Hey, look, what's that flying over your head? Quick, catch it, CATCH IT! AWWWW GEE WHIZ, YOU MISSED THE POINT. Darn it!

So, why don't you tell us what it's like to be a gay person, hmm? Go on, since it's obviously a choice, turn gay for a few minutes, then tell us what it's like. Did you go shoe shopping with your best female friends? Did you talk about cute guys? Whoops, better watch it, you're not allowed to lust for a person of the same gender. Go on, you're 13, you sure seem to know a lot!

For the record, I would post more detailed responses but for the fact that this is something like ten to one. Get over my not posting graduate theses in response to every single counter-examination. Maybe I have better things to do.

Oh, hey, why are you on a Pokemon site in the first place? I thought Pokemon was the Devil or shit like that due to them EVOLVING. Whoops, speaking of which, I need to evolve into a flying human real quick so I can get to the grocery store.

 

[Latiass]

Church, probably, but the law?

That is just ridiculous.

Generally, though, a priest is used in a wedding. In those cases, the Church has every right to deny it based on their religion, really.

EDIT: Wait, sorry, I misread what you said. I guess I am just agreeing with you, then.

Okay: http://www.evangelical.us/homosexuality/questions/homosexuality-harm-society.html
There's your argument. Voila.

This is the equivalent of me linking to a gay website speaking of the exact opposite. How about you link to some actual facts? Here, I'll assist you:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Men_who_have_sex_with_men#Health_issues. Don't like Wikipedia? http://data.unaids.org/pub/GlobalReport/2006/2006_GR_CH05_en.pdf

This is not that fucking difficult. You could have just made a valid point, but instead decided to spew your religious crap.

So, in response to this: why would this happen?

A comparison study of HIV-infected men found that those who had sex with men were especially unlikely to receive HIV preventative services even though they were more likely to report unprotected sexual intercourse with seronegative and unknown serostatus casual partners. This can lead to the rapid transmission of HIV among small clusters of gay men.​

One reason for this is that people refuse to treat homosexuals because they apparently have a higher risk of transmitting STDs. But it seems to be a vicious cycle. They would possibly have a lower chance of catching STDs if they could be treated. Is our medical system and society ready for this? Maybe. As has been said before, women were once denied rights based off their gender. That changed.

Also, I have no idea why this is (perhaps someone with psychological insight can offer their input), but it's worth noting that the average gay man sleeps with 4x more people than the average straight man. The thing I am unsure of is why they have a disposition for being.. slutty. This is also just an average. What would a study say if we took polls of the inverse (straight men sleeping with 16 women, gay men sleeping with 4)? Interesting.

On a broader scale, I do not find having homosexual feelings to be wrong. Many people have them without a choice. However, I find expressing those feelings to be wrong, just like I find things like adultery to be wrong. Sexual feelings are mainly for one purpose on a broad scale of things: reproduction. Bringing new life onto this Earth. Expressing them in other ways is wrong.

Can you elaborate on this? The first part, I mean ("expressing them"). Does this include privately, or just limited to publicly? If so, I do agree that public display of such things (not just homosexuality, but this in general) should be kept private. But that's because I enjoy my private life being, you know, private.

Also, no, they're not: we are sentient, we are capable of knowledge, and we know sex feels good. So we have it. Why? Because it feels good. My penis is designed for exactly whatever I want to use it for; same with my legs. If I decided to walk on my hands, you would see this as silly. However, I now have no legs. Is this still silly? No, I have to adapt.

The same could be said about homosexuality: as you admit...

On a broader scale, I do not find having homosexual feelings to be wrong. Many people have them without a choice.

... homosexuality is not a choice. Similar to the analogy above, I am finding a way to adapt to my genetic predisposition towards something (or my 'disability'); this happens to be by sticking my penis inside of someone. As you said, I don't have a choice, right?

EDIT:

Oh, hey, why are you on a Pokemon site in the first place? I thought Pokemon was the Devil or shit like that due to them EVOLVING. Whoops, speaking of which, I need to evolve into a flying human real quick so I can get to the grocery store.

That was Catholic church. Also, I don't follow you here..? You say in the first part that sarcasm is bad and that all sarcastic arguments should be disregarded, then you make a smartass remark? Is your first part sarcastic? I am not being an asshole, I am curious as I really don't follow you here.

 

[Erindor the Espeon]

Do not talk to him that way!

Maybe you need help, especially in making a good argument, or something that actually makes sense.

I didn't mean him. I was pointing to his argument. Sorry if that was unclear.

 

[Dark Tyranitar]

Okay, I'm sorry for depriving you guys of a punching bag, but:

No, this is not admitting defeat. This is saying that I don't feel like having half of TCoD tell me that I'm an intolerant freaky prude who needs to learn some compassion. There is no way to convince you guys--every point I bring up simply makes you more set in your ways. Say what you want behind my back; I don't intend to come to this thread again. It is a pointless waste of my time.

No, I will not provide further validity of my arguments; the only reason you guys want "validity" is so that you can have fun "destroying my arguments". Have fun smack-talking me!

 

[Latiass]

No, this is not admitting defeat. This is saying that I don't feel like having half of TCoD tell me that I'm an intolerant freaky prude who needs to learn some compassion. There is no way to convince you guys--every point I bring up simply makes you more set in your ways. Say what you want behind my back; I don't intend to come to this thread again. It is a pointless waste of my time.

No, I will not provide further validity of my arguments; the only reason you guys want "validity" is so that you can have fun "destroying my arguments". Have fun smack-talking me!

What? I asked you valid questions, and I wasn't being a dick, either. But, you know, if you think so, then I have no intention of continuing this discussion with you.

 

[ultraviolet]

You can control you feelings of sexuality, J.T. at least to some degree. Go see a psychiatrist. Talk it through. You can get mental help.

Did you know that when my Grandad was a kid, he was bullied by the church for being left-handed because it was the sign of the devil? It wasn't anything he could help, but he was still repeatedly corrected and punished by the church for his left-handedness.

Of course, left-handedness isn't anything that anyone can help, is it? Neither is homosexuality. It's exactly like saying that you aren't allowed to be attracted to girls and should go seek psychological help for being attracted to the opposite sex.

Besides this whole argument is ridiculous; oh teh noes people are different to us let's forbid them from having the same rights as us. >:| Grow the fuck up. Two gays fucking is in no way harming you or changing your life, and they're still going to do it whether you like it or not. I don't care about your religion and neither do most gays/bis/lesbians; your religion doesn't apply to them, why the fuck should they care if the bible said it, if it's natural or if the majority of people think it's wrong. Homosexuality isn't going to harm you and really these people aren't any different from you. They're just trying be with the people they love.

And fuck, if you're going to ignore that according to the bible women have no rights, shellfish is evil and slavery is a-okay, why can't you ignore that homosexuality is 'wrong' too? Would it do you so much harm to choose love instead of hate? There is absolutely no reason to hate on homosexuals - even if your religion says so, because I'm sure that they don't give two shits about your god/s.

Religion simply isn't a good excuse because it doesn't apply to everyone. Frankly I'm gonna go kiss some girls because I really don't care what Jesus thinks.

And why should people who are not homosexual be able to pick and choose the rights of homosexuals? It doesn't affect you anyway. How about the non-religious choose the rights of the religous, and see how that feels. Let's say that Christians can't marry because I'm not christian and I don't like Christians. It's not natural. It makes me sick. My favourite novel says so. They shouldn't allowed to be Christian in public. etc, etc.

I'm not Christian, so I don't care how you guys feel, I don't care if you guys want to get married, pray to God, whatever. I just don't like you guys.

Of course, that's an example, but see the similarities? It doesn't feel good to be persecuted for no reason that you can understand.

 

[Vladimir Putin's LJ]

Dark Tyranitar your religion enforces marriage between one man and several women so you don't have the moral high ground here.
And obviously, you run away after two pages of arguing and you post an image declaring us retards when you freely chose to come here and express your opinion and thus should be prepared for the consequences.
Pussy.

 

[Latiass]

Dark Tyranitar your religion enforces marriage between one man and several women so you don't have the moral high ground here.
And obviously, you run away after two pages of arguing and you post an image declaring us retards when you freely chose to come here and express your opinion and thus should be prepared for the concequences.
Pussy.

Normally, I don't like being a dick or showing signs of weakness during discussions - however, this was hilarious. Because it's also true. I know quite a few Mormon's, and it really is true.

 

[Eevee]

There is no way to convince you guys--every point I bring up simply makes you more set in your ways.

Really. It is entirely possible to change my mind; the facts to do so simply do not exist, which is why I hold the position I do. What would change your mind?

No, I will not provide further validity of my arguments; the only reason you guys want "validity" is so that you can have fun "destroying my arguments".

When every argument you have is validly struck down, that means that you are wrong.

This is the very crux of debating. If it is absolutely impossible, regardless of new discoveries or evidence or reasoning, to convince you that you are wrong, then you should not be debating anything. That is the very definition of irrational, and blind adherence to anything does not belong here.

 

[Zeph]

I didn't want to have to step into this debate (again? I can't remember if I've posted here before), as I prefer to just lurk and watch, but Erindor and Dark Tyranitar, observe this analogy if you will:

I don't think religious people should be allowed to be in relationships with eachother.

It's unnatural and disgusting. You're not born religious so why should you become it?

OH WAIT I can't say that because it's discrimination and denying people of their rights.

I'm very sorry for insulting your religion. Now kindly stop insulting homoseuxals.


(And before you jump on me, no, I don't really religious people should be condemned, however I do think it tends to have a negative effect on society.)

 

[Harlequin]

If being around homosexuals makes you gay then how are gays raised by heterosexual parents with heterosexual siblings and friends gay? I wasn't around anyone to learn homosexuality from so, um, how did I learn it?

I certainly don't remember ever making a choice to be attracted to men and none of the gays I know did, either.

I'm not sorry but any Mormon based sources are complete and utter shit. The Mormons are very homophobic. That's like using Nazi sources to prove that Jews are evil or something like that. It's like using white supremacist sources as a base to outlaw (again) interracial marriages.

Holy fucking shit I had sex with a man. THIS IS AN OUTRAGE. oh god I want to have access to the legal benefits that my straight counterparts can have, please shoot me for I am ABOMINATION.

Marriage has nothing to do with religion. It is a legal contract which allows couples certain tax benefits etc. The religious marriage ceremony has nothing to do with the civil marriage benefits. Gay people are people too. We're people who are born homosexual and we can't change it. It doesn't harm anyone and why should we be denied rights because your superstitions say we can't have them?

 

[opaltiger]

The fact is, that segment has just as many rights as the rest of the population, they just happen to want to have more rights.

I am curious as to why people who make this argument never comment when it is pointed out that the exact same situation was present in the case of interracial marriage not all that long ago.

ETA: Also I like how you post a link to the Mormon Times, ask for proof that it's biased, then in the same post say it is your Mormon religion that makes you opposed to homosexuality.

 

[Erindor the Espeon]

Dark Tyranitar your religion enforces marriage between one man and several women so you don't have the moral high ground here.

Actually, our religion used to do that, but that was back in the 1800's. Don't ask me why we used to do that, but we definitely don't do that now. The laws have changed to between a man and a woman. :/

Zephry: Several things similar to that have indeed been posted. But I see your point.

 

[voltianqueen]

We destroy your arguments in the first place because they are invalid. We want validity because we want you to prove it to us that being gay is harmful.

I still don't understand when it became anyone else's business as to who people can and cannot have sex with and/or marry.

 

[Music Dragon]

Well, it's a good thing he stopped. By being against homosexuality he was infringing on my right to feel contented.

 

[Teh Ebil Snorlax]

Humans are natural. Murderers are humans. Therefore murdering people is murderers are natural.
Humans are natural. Racists are natural. Therefore racism is racists are natural.

Dark Tyranitar, put the gun down, you've missed the point enough times, shot putt lessons are over. Murderers are living things. Murdering people is an act. I don't understand how you were able to compare them. Racists are living things. Racism is an ideology. I don't understand how you were able to compare them.

Guys, I'm sorry but please stop posting for a while. By not bombarding them with posts, we get to destroy their get-out-of-jail-free card.

Now.

This is to Erindor, Dark Tyranitar, Sir Lucario, Time Psyduck, anyone who cares to respond.

RESPOND TO THIS.

You claim that homosexuality is unnatural.
- If so, explain this;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_animals_displaying_homosexual_behavior
- Are we to assume therefore that you are opposed to such evil things as the Internet, computers, the Cave of Dragonflies, keyboards, mouses, monitors and *gasp* Lucario?
- Humans are natural. Gays are humans. Therefore gays are natural.

Also, the following are not valid responses;
- Mocking of my arguments.
- Dismissing my arguments with your religion. There is a reason that there is a separation between church and state.
- Not answering by saying something like "Read my previous posts lolol."

 

[EvilCrazyMonkey]

Okay, I'm sorry for depriving you guys of a punching bag, but:

Yeah lol even though we use logic we're still retarded.
I'm still glad I use logic.

No, this is not admitting defeat. This is saying that I don't feel like having half of TCoD tell me that I'm an intolerant freaky prude who needs to learn some compassion.

stop saying i use the victim card

There is no way to convince you guys--every point I bring up simply makes you more set in your ways. Say what you want behind my back; I don't intend to come to this thread again. It is a pointless waste of my time.

There is a way to convince us: logic. I suggest you learn it. It, in fact, is a pointless waste of your time to debate without logic.

No, I will not provide further validity of my arguments;

validity of your arguments never existed in the first place
sorry, learn logic, try again

the only reason you guys want "validity" is so that you can have fun "destroying my arguments". Have fun smack-talking me!

We only destroy your arguments because they are fucking stupid.
As I've said, sorry, learn logic, try again.

edit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYPVISQR9fY